/dead/ - dead

Hey, sorry to hear you're going through this. I kinda know the feeling of being both very dedicated to the cause of a better world, but also disheartened and feeling like the world, my personal life and mental health were deteriorating.
I'll try to make this as compressive and short as possible, starting with the big picture and ending with the fine practical details.

Honestly, the best solution to some degree is a change. A change of scenery. America/Muh Britain is a mental health nightmare, and there is a vast spiritual poverty that comes with the material wealth.
But other changes would probably help, especially if they went along with a change of scenery.

>You mentioned philosophy.

Stoicism is ok, but I find the flatline of emotion pretty deadening as well. Obviously, the opposite, moving whichever way whim and emotional dictate, isn't the answer either.
I know it's cheesy, but a sort of optimism and growth mindset is incredibly important: acting in a way that assumes things we encounter are opportunities for overcoming rather than roadblocks or obstructions, embracing challenge to become better or more refined in whicher direction you decide.
Having a purpose and meaning is hugely important, but we overlook that facing change and difficulty is a key part of purpose and meaning, since it gives purpose and meaning something to be tested against.

On one hand, people on the far left (communists and anarchists) start out with a strong purpose and meaning. But their purpose and meaning is so pie in the sky (total rearrangement of everything under heaven, so to speak) that they naturally grow disillusioned.

On the other hand, the modern world sort of broadly robs people of the opportunity for meaningful struggle. Traditional value systems that everyone sort of believed in became uprooted, yet everything has become domesticated and safety regulated, all while arenas of competition grew to a global scale and thus opportunities for even minor success shrank. This kinda represents the social kindling of the widespread existential crisis today.

So what to do about it. You mentioned absurdism as a wet fart. I agree when it's a sad internet meme. Victor Frankl certainly disagreed with Camus all around.
But if life is meaningless and the task is to simply enjoy it, it begs the question of what sort of preconditions would make this possible. What would you have to actually do to enjoy the meaningless unending suffering of life? What kind of life would you need? And what sort of person would you need to become?
The simple answer is feeling victorious, i.e., creating and confronting various challenges and walking away feeling victorious rather than defeated. That is to say pursuing, to some degree, a feeling of accomplishment. It could be for anything - gaining skills is a wonderful one, so long as it's something that interests and tests you physically or intellectually. Similarly, as important as a to-do list, is a to-be. What sort of person, quality wise, would you be happy and feeling accomplished as. Artful? Descisive? Empathetic? Strong? Etc. It's sometimes worth making that list and working off that.
You can pick values and more importantly goals that reflect them.

One of the things that's so toxic about blackpillers is that they believe the most disempowering bullshit ever. They think their fate is sealed and they will only be met with negative outcomes with women. Even most guys, being raised as fags - constantly seek permission. In reality, it much more better, to assume things will go right and just being sensitive to avoiding creating red light situations. (Then refine later) Of course, it helps if you are 'set up' with a decent physique (attainable) and better than average hygiene.

Now apply this to life in general. Regardless of 'the muhreality of meaninglessness, it's simply better and more advantageous even to apply that latter white pill mentality to everything.

Of course, you have to start small. (From lower form to higher, if you want to be spregy Marxist about it) Your challenges/goals here shouldn't be something too unrealistic or grandiose, but it can be supported by values and transcendent goals. They should be personal, something you can manage to effect and see demonstrable outcomes in your own life and character. Learning something ranging from coding to boxing, improving a pet project like a website (hint hint), getting jacked and juicy, or fucking a bunch of qts - whatever rocks you boat. But to that end, stacking small mental 'wins' and taking that growth mindset can go a long way into feeling better generally.
It's Peterson-esque, but there is truth to bio chemistry and the the social serotonin response, which is associated with a general sense of well being. An easy way to 'hack' this is a practice of gratitude (consciously naming 3 things you're grateful for, usually in the morning or evening). It literally takes 10 seconds every day but is pretty powerful.

Like a mentioned, scenery something's needs changed. Sometimes that includes people who are mentally or otherwise pulling us down into a crab bucket. Distance yourself from them asap and obviously.

Plants. Indoor in pollution is real. Plants are a cheap solution which have also been shown in studies to improve mood.

Finally, there's a basic physiological aspect of mental health. Sleep is a big one. Obviously, sometimes you have to grind, but it's hard to maintain sanity outside of your 20s on 6 hours of sleep every day.

There are several vitamins and nutrients that are associated with mood and mental health. Some that come to mind are vitamin d, vitamin c, zinc and folate. If you're plant based, it's necessary necessary to get B12. Carnitine and creatine probably wouldn't hurt either. Obviously, reduce/excise fast food and most processed food if possible. Seed oils and mystery margarine are kinda gross. Olive, coconut are my go to.
Personally, I think exercise is hugely important. I'd be depressed if I was fat and wasn't exercising. In that case, in a way, maybe the depression is trying to tell you something. Don't underestimate the physical mind body connection when it comes to mental health. Luckily, it's also nearly impossible to 'feel depressed ' 3/4 the way through a 10k jog.

I hope that kinda helps.

Finally, given all of the above, I think there's also an egotist argument for why you shouldn't kill yourself. If that happens after this effortpost, it would mean I wasted my time and failed.

I am consistently appalled at how hypocritical, selfish and lacking in self-awareness posts such as this one are.

>>2428
The feeling of meaninglessness might go away in a class-less society.
Meaning is probably derived from controle over the surplus you produce.
So there is hope that this will go away once we can live in a socialist society.

The sense of insignifiance is the result of living in mass society, that can't really be helped but you can learn to ignore it.

>On top of this we are surrounded by idiots at any given point
Most people have unrealised potential, don't think of people as idiots think of them as not fully realised.

You are complaining about your mood leading you to contemplate sucide.
If you have interests in a technical project i suggest you try out one of the diy opensource electroencephalogram headsets.
You can use those to play games that use brainwave feedback and train yourself to have controle over your mood.

>>2430
This literally means nothing

>>2432
I agree, OP literally means nothing.

>>2433
Wow good one

>>2431
>The feeling of meaninglessness might go away in a class-less society.
bullshit, it will only be amplified. and this is good. the spirit that is in human bodies needs to be free

>>2435
What do you mean it needs to be free?
the concept of our meaninglessness is frighting to your average normie. Hell it's frightening to me.

Haven't you read Nietzsche? God is dead and we killed him? The death of god and its consequences are horrifying.

Life may be meaningless, but we are not here to suffer. We can do things to not suffer, or suffer less. There is no inexorable push to make us suffer as much as possible, except in the minds of those who wish to lord over us. There is that in the world which is simply abomination, like Eugenics, and that which is at least tolerable. Whether we want the world without maximal suffering is a different question. It may very well be that humans are drawn to this misery and that explains why it went the way it did, when we obviously could have done better. There was no true technological reason or a crass motive that suggested we had to suffer, and this includes the past where we supposedly didn't know better. There was no excuse for the predation of feudal nobles or the lies and more lies that have been offered. All of that is one scam after another, and there were these strange progressive types who asked a simple question - why do we need to suffer like this? The answer, bombshell, is that we never needed to do this. Socialism in its early modern conception asked this very question and gradually it was transformed into something entirely alien to what it originally suggested. It is not that socialism will create a world without suffering, but that we could easily do better than arranged wars that the elite treat like a sport, sacrificing us mostly so they can have their jollies, with the excuse that every other noble does it. The idiotic behavior of nobles and the bourgeois are imposed on the whole world, even as most of us and enough of the bourgeois class see the entire enterprise of war and immiseration as pointless and obviously fixable. All it requires is enough people feeding vice and cruelty to keep the cycle going, and a belief imposed that you're not allowed to stop any of it. If we were allowed to stop it or even walk away from it, it would not be this bad. Guess what certain people make their mission to ensure, even as the will of many pissed off people would upend it without vast expense spent to suppress any resistance to a sick ruling idea.

Some idiots will say "durrr capitalism is about profits", and this is a dumbass line. Capitalists are interested in survival before they can consider profitability, and largely see that capitalism is unworkable and no longer in their interest as it has existed. The movement to keep us in misery is class collaborationist and does not conform to some crass motive at all. If we were interested in profitability towards some aim and held perfect information, those with money would likely see the futility of market exchange when you could just arrange affairs in a way that is equitable and doesn't push people to torture each other and themselves over stupid horseshit. Even if they wished to maintain their superior position and wealth, it would be preferable to give a little now and let the little people have their creature comforts and possibility of promotion. It is something entirely different that suggests "die die die die die" is the answer instead of basic shit that any liberal or socialist could understand. All defenses of capitalism today are defenses of its eugenic function, rather than a belief that markets are the only possible way or that the law of the market is somehow a path to the good. Only retards believe the latter, and the former is a condition the liberals knew to be a terrible one and not really a necessary one. Only by making socialism appear as this impossible visage instead of something very practical did the liberals suggest that we had to respect property and money, and for themselves, they have a very different sense of what is valuable. The only people incredulously believing the money myth are the petty ranks of managers who are just there to push down the little people - that's literally all they do and they are habituated to perform it like animals.

>>2538
See, people say I'm a doomer for talking about eugenics so much, but I'm trying to tell people that if they don't answer this basic question, nothing they say about economic systems is relevant. I find it curious how they're always going to bat for eugenics, which many people regard as a depraved abomination with a known history of rampant lying and abuse for no gain, but they tell us that we need to follow the latest narrative that will never work so long as the eugenics question remains intact. Those people are the fucking worst slime. At least the outright eugenists and the fascists claim they're on the winning side and see a few benefits. These trolls and shills don't even receive the silver that Judas got.

>>2429
Underrated post.

>>2432
just like everything else, then

>>2538
Even if we can and should focus on creating a world where there is as little suffering as possible it's still an objective fact that life is suffering. The struggle for existence; The world we live in basically is trying to kill us at any point in time. Ouir continued survival is a combination of luck, skill and mutual aid.

>>2542
Good point. Leftoidism and its goals, such as 'ending suffering,' are quite naive.

>>2542
Life is a lot more than suffering. If it is reduced to that, then there is no point and you don't need any philosophy or religion to tell you how to escape. If you believe life is suffering and innately doomed to be this, the only real answer is to off yourself as soon as possible, because none of this shit means a thing. You can train yourself to die without too much difficulty, and a lot of Buddhism like many religions is about preparing people to die, in one way or another. Another soul in the cycle feeds the priesthood money and power, and that's what it is all for. You don't need them to tell you how to die though, and usually they give you bad advice so they can milk every ounce of suffering out of you. You don't owe those bastards one iota of suffering. If I'm going to suffer, it won't be for their sake. That's when you see the proactive role of religion and spiritual authority, and its intent to invade your life and every inch of the world with a very pernicious disease.

The point of these doctrines is to consume as much human effort as possible in struggle, struggle, struggle, which is designed to lead nowhere, while those in the know laugh at fooling the plebs and keeping them in the dark. In secret they practice orgies and party off the proceeds of anyone fool enough to work. That's their mentality. They don't have any other reason, and they'll destroy the world before they give up their "pleasure", which is purely premised on denying other people things. That's all they ever believed in. They only produce a single thing in pursuit of that goal of maintaining the orgy, when they absolutely have to and can't make us build all of their machines and think for them. There you have the basis of slave society and civilization, in their view. Everything we aspire to, everything we produce, is turned to serve that beast.

>>2542
Of course, their view of the world is a stupid one, but as long as it can perpetuate itself and no one is around to say no, there is nothing in humanity or nature that stops it. Because exploitation is the quickest path to victory and resolution of the general fear that is the condition of humans in society, such religions have a strong advantage over a religion which values labor or genuine human genius, or values development of the soul in the true meaning of the word. In the end, the moment it becomes historically and technologically possible, the priests of the world drop the mask and show what this really was. That is what we are living through in the 21st century.

Nihilism is sufficient if you're like 12 and have no creativity. Eventually you'll graduate to existentialism or something if you need an -ism to cope with not knowing what to draw / build next.

Have I not posted in this thread? I'm sort of surprised.

>Or the heninistic approach.

The what?

>>2549

12 year olds are more creative than most old farts tbh. Not always, yeah, but a lot of the time. Tbqh most of us old people are just decayed versions of our younger selves.

And I don't apply the term 'nihilism' to my outlook, but if, by chance, you might mean to include my outlook (mine being that dead is better and life is a fundamentally inferior and inherently deluded state of material being), then I'd suggest that, at least where I'm concerned, you have it backwards.

I came to existentialism before what some would describe as 'nihilism' - which is to say that prior to embracing a conception of death as universal salvation (inhibited only by the continuation of the possibly unstoppable life cycle), I entertained existentialism. It's nice ideas, and it's perfectly splendid wee rules for living… although its conscious adherents often just turn into neurotics, even if they were what philosophical wankers would describe as "ubermensch" previously… actually, despite its good messages, I think it's not unfair to say that partaking in conscious existentialism, attempting to realize the abstract version of a certain way of life, is in practice a bit like partaking in the fruit of the tree of knowledge - sometimes the most realized man is the one who frolics naked through Eden, but when he eats that apple he will be consumed by shame at his nakedness, at his honesty, at his unthinking joy. This isn't to say that it played out entirely this way for me, but it at least partially played out this way… and for most, it seems to be much worse than partially. People who obsess themselves with ideological concepts of realization & liberation often only become further alienated from what they are, from what transcends them… even if the book they read tells them not to do it, they end up reasserting the little neurotic constructs built from the human ego, they end up inside of a new mental cage which tells them to tear down mental cages. They turn into goofy philosophy dorks.

The only real way out of this is… out.

>>2552

The dirty secret is that there was no "fall". We always knew we were evil and irredeemable. The "fall" was that we introduced a lie that there was such a thing as "the good", which only served to refine our evil to make it more deliberate and calculated. Nothing fell and nothing was liberated by knowledge.

Freedom in a genuine sense was never about an idea or state of mind, but an actual condition of humans and their person. If you can't defend yourself, or if you are forbidden to defend yourself, you don't have freedom. This is not impossible, and we've always been able to walk away in nature if we really wanted to. Nothing in the world compelled us to be around each other in this way, or compelled us to be around each other at all. We would be far better off if we just didn't talk to each other so much, and chose the type of associations and interactions we would maintain. That has always been known, but it is the task of philosophy to drag those who do not know into the abyss, and hoard knowledge as something permitted only with privileged access. In particular, the knowledge of who and what rules is obscured, and ultimately the very idea of knowledge is mutated into something very different from what knowledge was in our primitive and native sense of what things are. None of us never needed that, and we would have been far better off if we chose to speak to each other as actual humans. That is too much for those who held conceits that they were better, for the only way to maintain that conceit is to see others deprived and locked out. Otherwise, the fear of that conceit being terminated will remain.

There are many ways to resolve this so that humanity doesn't have to do this, and could make their lives and the world as good as they can make it - which is not much. If the concept of the good is defined by the thrill of those who lord over us, though, why would that ever be allowed to exist? There is no force in nature of humanity that would change that, and there is no way to convince those people by reason to be nice. If that worked, I and my whole family would be much happier, and not have to go through what we did while a bunch of Satanic retards cavort like they are something special. Seeing the worst assholes invariably win by design, and their venality encouraged, did nothing. They didn't even kill us or protect the thing they ostensibly were defending. They did it because it didn't occur to them to do anything else, and many who did this to us can't say they gained even the small pleasure they thought they would get. They did it because they were induced to do so, and because the values of the society told them to worship stupidity, cruelty, and vice as values. Humans were paid to be stupid and promote the rot, and this fit the intent of those who held the bank. We were warned about banking establishments since modernity began and letting this become what it did; but then, who do I blame for really causing the rot? The people who were paid to promote the rot knew exactly what they were doing and most had every choice to stop it. None of the torture that has been inflicted served any purpose other than a conceit that the world was overpopulation and viciousness was in of itself the good. There may have been those who were desperate and pressed to attack due to fear of punishment, but these were always the low-level grunts, who were tossed aside the moment they did their dirty work. Anyone who is really effective at sadism is perfectly aware of what they do, and the sadists are granted security and praise for their actions because those are the values of the empire at present. I have seething contempt for middle class graspers who did this out of some bullshit conceit that they were going to somehow win or make the world a better place through torture, and who indulged in some faggotry or another and went out of their way to destroy the concept that there could be any decency. Most humans are not like this. Even nasty people can recognize the value of not starting this shit or making it worse than it had to be. It is a certain sort of person, and there are not too many of these people but they are a sizable portion of humanity, who make it their business to see others suffer, because that really is their core value and self-justifying. Because those people could do what they did and we were not permitted to tell them no, we got the world we got for the past century.

>>2552
I've always maintained though that suicide - true suicide - is the first genuine freedom, the concept of clean death and escape from the cycle of feeding and thrill-seeking. We shouldn't have to kill ourselves to find freedom, but the moment you tell someone suicide is never an option, you are holding them captive. Every abusive mother knows how to do this, and it is inherent to every slavery. The "suicide cult" and worship of death in neoliberal society is not clean death or even genuine suicide. Not that many people would commit suicide out of boredom or a general fear if they truly asked themselves the prospects for living, if they could live in any society that was tolerable. The idea of a total society is that suicide is only possible in the state of maximal fear, and this is inculcated in the slaves to impress upon them that they are close to death and have a knife at their throat at all times, and to tell them this is completely normal and they should be happy in this condition. What they are not allowed is the concept of a dignified death, or suicide as an act of final protest. The residuum, who are valueless, are "allowed" this in some way so long as it is invisibilized and the general fear polices the residuum to drive them to maximal fear and torture. Anyone of value is threatened with severe punishment if they even hint at the idea of a clean death. The choice of life and death is always monopolized by the holder of imperium, which is not any of the officers in the final judgement. All suicides and deaths must be commanded and justified by the imperial authority, and by extension, all life and life functions are commanded and justified by the imperial authority. This is the heart of eugenism and the society it must create. It is only when it came to the forefront that we have today's attitudes towards suicide, laws concerning it, and moral theories about what suicide is. In the past, whatever the religious prohibition, suicide was seen as a crime against the state. The punishment for suicide was death. The punishment for attempted suicide is that you were dragged in front of everyone and they finished you off painfully, to set an example. In practice, though, the message was clear - if you want clean death, do it yourself and do it right, and don't say anything unless you trust someone. There was a way in which suicide was, for free men and women, a matter of some honor. The idea of shaming someone for choosing suicide out of "responsibility" is very modern. The intent of that moral shrieking is very clear - the eugenist craves to push someone to suicide by commanding "DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE" and revelling in the terror as someone kills themselves in a state of absolute agony. Any abusive mother knows this and conditions their failed children in this way. Decent people, and even the abusive mothers and fathers have some remorse about this, understand that this is sad and should not be encouraged. Often family abuse is more complicated than the eugenic core ideology. Only the fanatical true believers will maximize the torture of their children for the glory of the state and the eugenic creed, and those abusers are glorified and protected and we are told they are upstanding citizens doing the right thing, in all cases. The eugenic creed cannot allow anything else.

I have stayed alive mostly because every day I live and find some shred of happiness in this life, anything I can claw back from those assholes, is a living monument to my hatred for them, and a living example of the failure of their creed. Even if I am the last and the whole world becomes maximal eugenics, compliance is not an option for me. To comply with this or accept it is abomination.
If I am to die for whatever reason, then that is that. I've lived my life with the expectation that the next torture session is around the corner, because that is what humanity is. Pretending it is not like that is sin. In my mind, it should just be stated what humanity is, and there should be no ambiguity or pretense. Historically, there wasn't. Most writers of the past openly acknowledged the ugliness of the human race, without glorifying it. They lived in a world where reason and truth were still possible in the open. The slave and the peasant had enough sense to know when they were lied to. The habitual lying at the heart of the present intellectual cult of power is something new, and far more pernicious than anything that has ever existed. What we are going through now is the worst thing humanity has ever seen, and we're just getting started. I grew up expecting this to be the outcome. I didn't expect it to come right now or this suddenly, and I didn't expect it to be this stupid. I thought the sadists were smarter than this, but it turns out they really are just a bunch of Satanic apes that managed to jabber enough to make us go along with it. What a damn joke.

>>2555
That all said, these days I don't live for any of that shit. I don't live for "society", the state, or any expectation of proof. I don't live for crass material things. I don't live just because out of some degenerate sense of me wantee. I don't live because I think I'm going to somehow develop a soul in my own world, although that would be better than indulging in the shit that is valued in this society. I've found a moral sense of what is actually worthwhile that doesn't revolve around this stupid game we were made to play, and it is not the infantile belief that I get to declare my own morality and make others accept it. I can choose what I do with this time, and that places me in a better situation than a lot of us. It won't amount to much, but the genuine sense of freedom would demand this. Freedom in any real sense would entail the nonexistence of large institutions that can do this to us. There is no other way. The ruin of the contending classes is the only outcome of society, unless humanity chooses to do something new, that has not been part of anything in its history. There is no past example to draw from to make this new thing. It has to be constructed with the means available to us in the 21st century, with insight into what has been created up to now. It would require us to find out what this really was and assess its true meaning - or rather, what pushed humanity to become this, instead of the numerous outcomes which would have been better.

>>2428
so have you fucking killed yourself already you fag?

>>2554
>Anyone who is really effective at sadism is perfectly aware of what they do, and the sadists are granted security and praise for their actions because those are the values of the empire at present. I have seething contempt for middle class graspers who did this out of some bullshit conceit that they were going to somehow win or make the world a better place through torture, and who indulged in some faggotry or another and went out of their way to destroy the concept that there could be any decency.

Love this line.